Message Board - BigPumpkins.com

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

Pete,

We currently don't have the sites broken out by Howard Dill Award status. Probably because they are free to choose where & when to present an HDA at their own discretion.

Individual sites decide what criteria they feel best meets the HDA standard. It is therefore also the site that decides whether they will present a HD award or not. I believe that some sites choose to avoid this award for fear of getting involved in the judging of what might be considered a "speculative interpretation".

It has been my experience that some sites have trouble weighing the "weight versus color & shape" aspect of judging. Some sites permit small HD entries (which are likely well shaped) while others expect color to accompany a minimum weight (usually 500 lbs).

It's quite a challenge.

It's also a valid subject for further discussion. Once folks settle into the off-season perhaps the board can revisit this subject. We can at least ask each site to make public their HDA status prior to weigh-off season & get it onto the GPC website BEFORE folks decide where to enter their pumpkin.

10/31/2008 11:43:34 PM

LongmontPete

Colorado

Steve,

I understand the challenge that weigh-off sites face when dealing with the subjective issues of "beauty", and I can see why a site would possibly want to avoid conflict here. Personally, I disagree with that view (I would certainly rather finish 2nd in the vote than to have no vote at all), but I can see why a site would want the weigh-off to be a day with no conflict. After all, we're just growing pumpkins.

I agree with your suggestion that it would be valuable for sites to declare their HDA status prior to weigh-off.

11/1/2008 1:06:06 AM

South Bloomfield, Ohio

Steve and Pete,

Subjectivity is is certainly a concern when judging for anything but weight and, for that reason, I offer this suggestion:

Allow an independent group to come to your weighoff and explain to them the criteria for the award. Let THEM do the judging.

At Circleville, judging for the Nancy Martin Prettiest Pumpkin Award is done by the Circleville Art League. At Chillicothe, the prettiest pumpkin is chosen by the Lowe's employees who help handle the pumpkins during the weighoff.

11/1/2008 8:14:49 AM

Dave & Carol

Team Munson

The HD award can be very hard to judge for most people and end up with hard feelings after the decision. The most effective way I have seen is to have a ballot box with pieces of paper and pen then have the MC plugging the voting to all spectators. This allows growers and on lookers to vote as they see fit, this takes the pressure off the judges or group of people who would decide this award.

11/1/2008 8:37:28 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

I agree with Dave on this. If the judging staff lacks experience &/or can't take controversy, take the heat off the judges & give it to someone else.

Some sites have an elected official make the final call. Our own Mayor is no stranger to controversy or criticism so if he knew about pumpkins he'd be a good scapegoat errr....judge. Public personalities like our own weigh-off's MC (cable news weatherman) will put on a good show & make it enough fun that folks don't get offended at the outcome. Or have the audience vote through the MC. Make it a fun & noisy public voting event Like a "people's choice" sort of a deal.

Another option is for the weigh-off to set some clearly defined standards & have them posted well in advance. These standards should be in the spirit of Howard's long term goals for his name sake Atlantic Giant.

Danny told me a couple years ago that Howard felt the weight "should" be a minimum of 500# or so based on available entries for that site. Most sags & dill rings won't become evident until pumpkins start packing weight. To avoid folks growing a "ringer" just for shape & color, site committees can state in advance that the HDA will only be awarded within (for instance) the top 30% of the entries.

This is more important than it sounds since *heavy-deep-orange-color* is a tall order to fill. But it was a goal that Howard believed in & the award is named for the man.

One caveat might by percent heavy to chart.
Another could be symmetry so no sag lines, camel backs or dill rings.
Another could be deep orange in uniformity with no yellow flecks.
Another might be percent heavy without cantelouping...

The possible areas to judge for the HDA are many. Beauty pageants must be REAL politically charged events. LOL

All I will recommend is that the site clearly establish the standards well in advance, train the judging staff, test their knowledge & post the standards well

11/1/2008 10:38:10 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

in advance of the registration deadline & keep the standards visible again at the weigh-off.

11/1/2008 10:39:28 AM

Rhode Island

at our weigh-off the sngpg pumpkin mafia judges who gets what.

even though you may have the heaviest entry ? if we think one looks bigger we award the plaque and prize money to that grower (no wonder one of our directors always wins)

anyone who complains gets beat up and stuffed into their trunk or under their entry.

we realize that this can cause hard feeling so next year in an attempt to be totally fair we are planning a new procedure for picking the howard dill award winner.

first we ask all who think they have a pretty pumpkin to raise their hand.

then? the pumpkin mafia gathers them all up in the center of the ring and hands each one an assortment of garden tools.
the last one standing gets the hd award

should work well and keep the bickering down to a minimum.

lol

pap

11/1/2008 10:05:30 PM

South Bloomfield, Ohio

That's it pap.......let the contenders duke it out.

11/1/2008 10:11:47 PM

Stunner

Bristol, ME (stunner906@roadrunner.com)

Yeah, for the love of Pete don't let them have any of those evil yellow fleck's...What would the world come to...

11/3/2008 4:41:20 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

I kind of like yellow flecks but again, beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Hmmm...didn't a guy named Stelts contribute to our yellow fleck disease?

11/3/2008 2:28:50 PM

Rhode Island

if you have the time to wait and count votes letting the crowd vote is the fairest way possible.
who gets prettiest has never been a issue with anyone at our weigh offs for many years.
its just not that big a deal with our contestants.

11/4/2008 6:56:52 AM

Boulder County Colorado USA planet Earth

Well for some of us, who never win any weigh offs or many ribbons I think it is. Howard dill award honors the man who helped get our great hobby off the ground. Sadly this yr you think would mean a lot since he past away.

PETE you had the prettiest pumpkin at the Flower Bin weigh off. This yr you were blessed with a son and a 1004 pound pretty pumpkin.

Just sorry I couldn't help you get it.

11/10/2008 10:03:37 AM

Boulder County Colorado USA planet Earth

But pete next yr if you want to duel with garden tools to decide the winner. Dad and I have your back with garden tools(We are owners of a landscape company lol) Dad says he has a chainsaw and I have a machete.lol

But at jared's next yr we may have no one left that walk lol

gardening tool duel 2009 Jared's cant wait.

11/10/2008 1:18:41 PM

Boulder County Colorado USA planet Earth

I meant to say we may have no one that can be able to walk.lol

11/10/2008 1:19:34 PM

South Bloomfield, Ohio

Yellow flecks won me the very first Nancy martin Award.

11/10/2008 9:16:03 PM

Rhode Island

CAPTAIN

I SHOULD HAVE CHOOSEN MY WORDS BETTER. MY INTENTION WAS NEVER TO OFFEND ANYONE OR EVEN GIVE THEM THAT IMPRESSION.
LET ME REPHRASE MY FEELINGS

THE PRETTIEST PUMPKIN AWARD ( AND THE RUSH TO FLUSH OR UGLIEST PUMPKIN AWARD ) IS JUST NOT A BIG CONCERN WITH MOST OF OUR CONTESTANTS OR SPECTATORS AS WELL.

I CONSIDER IT A GIANT PUMPKIN WEIGH-OFF NOT A PRETTIEST OR UGLIEST PUMPKIN WEIGH-OFF. THATS THE WAY ITS VIEWED.

I AGREE THAT A LOT OF GROWERS WILL NOT GET THE OPPORTUNITY TO FINISH HIGH ON THE LIST SO AN AWARD LIKE PRETTIEST MEANS A LOT. (HEY I WON IT AT TOPSFIELD A COUPLE YEARS AGO SO I KNOW THE FEELING)

TO HONOR HOWARD DILL YES ITS A GREAT AWARD.BUT ITS NOT WITHOUT ITS PROBLEMS EITHER. CHOOSING CAN BE DIFFICULT AT TIMES AND THERES ALWAYS THAT GROWER OR TWO WHO THINKS HE OR SHE GOT SCREWED.

A LOT OF CHOICE AWARDS HAVE BEEN ELIMINATED OVER THE YEARS BECAUSE THEY BECOME TO CONFRONTATIONAL.
POUNDS DONT LIE AND CAN NOT BE DEBATED EITHER SO FOR MY PART WEIGHING IS BELIEVING.

BEAUTY IS AND ALWAYS WILL BE IN THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER.

A VERY WISE MAN ONCE SAID TO ME " IF YA DONT LIKE IT ? GROW A BIGGER PUMPKIN" HE WAS RIGHT, SO WE DID.

PAP

PAP

11/11/2008 6:31:52 AM

Stunner

Bristol, ME (stunner906@roadrunner.com)

We all can't be part of the 'elite'. The fact is that many of the average growers and spectators alike do care about color. To try to convey that 'pretty' simply doesn't matter is like hiding one's head in the sand. There are many, many more facets to this hobby besides weight. There is personal achievement and self-satisfaction. There are those who grow and never take a fruit to a weigh-off, because it's not about that for them. It's about having a round, beautiful pumpkin on their porch come Halloween night for all their neighbors, children, grandchildren and family to enjoy. Does that make them any less of a grower? Of course it doesn't. These grower's don't need a namesake award or ribbon, just the smiles of local folks and children are all they need to make them believe their year was a success. Whether or not one is able to admit it or not, we've all been there at some point in our growing careers, each and every one of us. To say that color and pretty pumpkins don't matter is to say that one has forgotten their humble beginnings.

11/11/2008 8:03:51 AM

Bodene

Clayton, Ohio, USA

Some great points here. It's obvious that the goals of this sport are not the same for everyone - nothing wrong with that. I think that is a good thing and the more awards and recognition that we can come up with the better. If we want to grow this hobby and the organizations that make up the GPC it is important to have awards that recognize more than just weight. The Howard Dill award should be mandatory at all GPC sanctioned events and it should conatain a $$ award. A % heavy to the chart award could also be another good one - maybe call it the Pap Wallace award. Good winter food for thought here.

11/11/2008 9:37:34 AM

South Bloomfield, Ohio

Bodene,

Are you trying to say that pap is heavy to the charts?

11/11/2008 7:50:11 PM

Boulder County Colorado USA planet Earth

Money dosent matter to some of us. Why its the ribbons that will be around for yrs money gets but in the bank for the following seasons patch bills or spent.

The one thing I like about the Howard dill award is that its the prettest pumpkin bragging rights not money. (I do prefer when the public gets to vote vs judges) I know several growers that only have space for 1-2 pumpkins so they try to go for pretty. For some that is quite a goal and accomplishment.

I do like the Ugliest pumpkin Award. We could call it the ugly duck award(as to not insult any one) but no money just award.

11/11/2008 7:59:53 PM

Rhode Island

i give up

11/12/2008 3:30:49 AM

Boulder County Colorado USA planet Earth

Pap thanks for serving in the military, Happy late veterans day.

11/12/2008 8:52:11 AM

Brooks B

Ohio

I see what Paps trying to say, and I think the Howard Dill award does have meaning for him as well when you read between the lines he wrote.
Looks like Pap goes out of his way for such awards like the Howard Dill Ward, for growers that cant always grow the big one. Just look at the RI weigh off, look at all the diffrent things he puts together,like all them funky and also really nice placks/trophies/wood sculptures he and Joe make,lol. He definitely cares alot for the little guys that cant grow the big one from what I see. And please dont take this the wrong way, I'm not saying you guys are saying he doesn't care .

Stunner, the post you just put up says it all,and one of the best I have read in a long while, thanks for posting that, I really enjoyed reading it.

11/13/2008 10:10:08 AM

OkieGal

Boise City, Oklahoma, USA

We didn't have one this year, but. We start getting entries we will do the HD and it will be popular vote. That way it's fair. We'll also have the Brown Bag award as the opposite, and just ribbons for both. To get popular vote too, putting up a small door prize so people that vote put their name AND we can toss duplicate votes then is about the fairest.

I think it's good to honor the man that started us on this or helped us along....

I know, you bust heinie and end up with wormfood or not in the running, but. As I told the rest of our group; 2009 is going to be better, I'll help everyone be on the same footing, same chances, and if you whup my *ss I'll be both proud and crying... but still proud you did it.

We're going to have our potluck and awards soon; and I'm going to be very proud and happy to honor our big scale bender... even if I had four that were bigger and heavier-mine were ineligible this year to give *everyone else* a chance. I wasn't in most of the rest of ya's league this year so I didn't make the pilgrimage to elsewhere with them but.

The sport, the camraderie, and the kids meeting their first big ol' pumpkin; are why I grow. If I have to keep myself out of the running here and drive 250 miles to get one weighed elsewhere next year, I'll do it, for the sake of our club. The fun comes first, the ribbons and $ second, I'll take a bucket of bragging rights for half an hour on chat any time :)

Back to original post, IF a site is going to do the Howard Dill, it'd be nice if that is mentioned, or if they're not.

11/13/2008 11:19:26 AM

Dave & Carol

Team Munson

I thank all of you for posting, it is threads like this that helps us make things better for all growers. We will work on getting better info for each site as to what level they register at and what prize package they will receive from the GPC.

11/13/2008 4:59:13 PM

UnkaDan

I suggest that every site no matter what level they pay for GPC recoginition, should get the Howard Dill Award plaque,,,simply to honor the memory of the great man and what he did for us all.

Going back to Bill's "How we all started" idea it's the same with the new entry level sites, chances are the growers attending those events will be leaning to the orange and pretty side.

11/13/2008 6:39:25 PM

PumpkinBrat

Paradise Mountain, New York

If it wasn't for Howard Dill, none of us would be were we are today. I'd have to agree that every weigh-off should give out this great award.

11/13/2008 8:48:49 PM

South Bloomfield, Ohio

One question........Is the Howard Dill Award reserved exclusively for GPC sites?

11/13/2008 10:19:56 PM