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Minnesota(dw447@fastmail.fm)

There are so many 2006 crosses, that look great on paper. This year could be one of the best seed years ever, IMO. I'd like to hear what you think could be some of the best crosses of 2006.

I like the following(I'm keeping my color preferrences suppressed here, except for maybe the 955):

1450 Wallace(1068 X sibb)
1446 Werner(998.6 Pukos X 1068 Wallace)
1160 Rose(1068 Wallace X 723 Bobier)
1131 Rose(723 Bobier X 1068 Wallace)
955 Brinkley(1180 Delatas X 1370 Rose)....I may grow this one this year...could be great for heavy, big, and orange.
820 Parks(845 Bobier X 840 Parks)
I also like the 1068 X 1370 Rose, and reverse crosses.
These are just a few, of many great crosses IMO.

1/2/2007 3:28:26 PM

No Place Special

I like the 1450 myself. Reason: 1068 is best seed ever. 1450 is combination of the best two 1068's ever. They both were heavy and although not the best looking ever, they still looked like pumpkins. If I get one, it will go in here.

I also agree that 1068 x 1370 crosses look great.

1/2/2007 5:20:08 PM

Kalamazoo, MI (Jpwrhse@charter.net)

I have a 1370 x 1068 that I'm almost certain is my number one pick for next year, was thinking of crossing with a 723Bobier x 846.5 Calai to introduce some more 723 into the lines? Thoughts? I only have room to grow one good plant and a second as a pollinator which may or may not be kept after pollination. Still waiting for a couple of seed packs to come in so this could change but right now the opportunity to see what I could do with those kind of genetics gives me chills.

Jesse

1/2/2007 10:16:42 PM

Rhode Island

mike and doug send me a private email.

pap

1/2/2007 10:50:47 PM

Greencastle, PA

I think that 2006 was generally a very poor year for crosses. It seemed like everyone used the 1068 whenever possible, and it really isn't the best seed ever. Some 1068's are extremely good though, and the 1450 is a cross between two of extremely good ones. Dan McKie also had a good 1068. He made a lot of excellent crosses in 2006. My favorites from this year are as follows;
1169 Jutras (1354 Checkon x 845 Bobier), a 1354 that didn't hit a brick wall and went 9% heavy crossed with the 845
1308 McKie (1139 Sherwood x 1370 Rose) both parents had excellent shape and were among the largest offspring of their parents (the 1308 being the largest 1139 by far)
1058 Whittier (1332 Werner x 1231 Pukos) A mix of great 723,845,898, and 846 Genetics... pollinator grew 1160, but I don't know much about it

1/2/2007 10:53:26 PM

Greencastle, PA

forgot to add: the 1450 is probably going to be better that the 1068, because it is a combination of all of the good qualities of the 1068. Phenomenal size, no external evidence of internal flaws...

1/2/2007 10:56:56 PM

Owensboro, Ky.

"HEY YOU"...LOL are you out of yer mind!!! LOL How can you say that the 1068 isnt the greatest seed ever???? It just grew the first AG over 1500#!!!! I would also like to have a 1450, but as of now...from all the available evidence...1068 rules!!!!!!!!! How do ya think that Ron and Dick picked the two "extremely good" 1068 seeds? Not tryin to pick an argument, just curious how to decipher some of the things you said...."poor year for crosses" and "Some" 1068's are extremely good"? Peace, Wayne

1/3/2007 2:18:00 AM

Netherlands

Wayne, you tend to hear all of the success stories about the 1068, or any pumpkin for that matter. It is an amazing producer but several growers didn't have any success with the 1068 and hardly made it over 500 lbs. I think that is what "hey you" means.

If you calculate the average weight of the top ten pumpkins of the 723 and the 1068 (only the sound fruit) grown by other growers (so not the Wallaces or Bobiers) than the 723 wins 1260 lbs to 1216 lbs. If you do the same for the top five pumpkins then the 723 wins 1343 to 1273.

The 723 has been grown more often than the 1068 so in due time the 1068 might catch up. Perhaps this goes to prove the point that seeds are often most productive if they are your own.

1/3/2007 4:01:49 AM

Eastern Pennsylvania

Before this turns into a total slugfest over the 1068 I would like to cast my vote for the 1302 Zuhlke, 1370x810. Should offer great potential for big and orange.

1/3/2007 12:17:53 PM

Saegertown Pa.

some more good 2006 seeds.
1062.5 Parks ( 1370 X 1225) the male grew 1173.5 Parks both male and female 7% to 8% over chart and the 1062.5 was bright orange.
1177 Conley ( 842 X 1068 ) male grew the 1333 Conley, the 1177 was over chart.
1005.9 Werner ( 998 X 998.6 ) the male grew my 1446.5, the cross on the 998 ( 898 X 805 )
985 Werner ( 1370 X 898 ) both over chart.
I was at both weigh off's the 1177 and 1062.5 were weighed at and helped loud the 1062.5 and 1173.5 and talked to both growers about both male and female plants. I think one of the reason local seeds and ones from are own gardens do well is because we know a lot about the plants that grew them and have seen the pumpkins first hand.

1/3/2007 1:19:04 PM

Boulder County Colorado USA planet Earth

The sleeper seeds/pumpkins grown in 2006( seeds under $15 bucks) I like the 1302 Z the best, parents 1370 and the 810. I think this will be the sleeper seed, When it awakes I know it will do great things.
Also I think the 660 Dill is another seed that has great potiental. great cross and it's fairly cheap to buy. A great starter seed.

As far as state(under 1050 pounds) records being brocken yep it's going to happen. I predict, that Wyoming, Kansas,Ky,Tn and my homestate of colorado will suprise people this yr and the next couple yrs..Look at Michigan, went from 19 to top 10.wowsers.

1/3/2007 1:20:48 PM

Georgia

The 1302 Zuhlke sounds like a great cross if you can actually get a hold of any seeds.

1/3/2007 1:48:53 PM

Netherlands

Captain, my 1302 isn't going to be doing any sleeping. The 810 might bring down the weight a bit, but should boost the colour. Looking forward to growing it.

1/3/2007 2:04:06 PM

Netherlands

And Captain, the 660 Dill (810 x 1016) is sold out. The 660 D. Hampton (670 Daigle ‘03 x 1225 Jutras ‘03) is still available though.

1/3/2007 2:07:39 PM

Rhode Island

Throwing caution to the wind im going to give you my reasons why at the end of its run the 1068 will have amassed more over 1,100 offspring than any to follow for many many years to come.

1. Its the same reason why the 1068 can, and will, throw off any number of six different colors and shapes.
2. Its the same reason why 1068 duplicate crosses have and probably wont ever come close to the 1068.
3. And no, its not because only good growers have the seed.we sent out over 300 of the 1068 seeds in the fall of 2003.

We all know that due to inbreeding and such over the years that the atlantic giant seed has many different genes to pass on.
Which ones you get in your choosen hand pollinated fruit will decide what shape and color you pumpkin will be.

In other words i truely believe the genes that got crossed when we made the 1068 represented the best gene each 845 x 898 had to offer.( lady luck)

Had we kept a different pollinated pumpkin off the 845 who knows the results could have been much less successful.
Like the 961, which was the reverse cross (898 x 845) it has not had the run of the 1068 but also did not produce as well early on.

pap

1/3/2007 5:12:45 PM

Greencastle, PA

Wayne,
1. The vast majority of successful 1068 plants have grown in a very specific region of the country.
2. Several 1068's have had internal flaws such as dill rings
3. Some of them don't grow at all (one was planted alongside a 1097.5 Beachy and grew in the 100-300 range while the 1097.5 grew to over 900)

There are certainly great genes in there, but for the above reasons it does not (in my opinion) qualify as the best seed in the world.

Additionally, if you don't want to pick an arguement, don't spit vitriol. That's the kind of behavior you see from people who are either out of their minds or missing them completely.

1/3/2007 7:00:38 PM

Greencastle, PA

The 723 is a very interesting seed to look at. It is a 1999 seed and grew a 1407, the #3 pumpkin in the world in 2005. Obviously, 1400+ genes have been present since 1999. That suggests to me that the weight increases we've seen can be more acurately attributed to improvements in growing techniques. Maybe that's why the 1502 came from the 1068. It was an excellent 1068 seed grown by the best grower(s) in the world who have a lot of experience with that particular seed.
Genetics is like a game of cards, and getting a great seed is a matter of luck. My opinion of the 898/845 crosses is that there are too many cards to draw from. However, the 1450 seems to have every ace from the 1068's deck.

1/3/2007 7:10:09 PM

Saegertown Pa.

could we get back onto the topic, if you guys want to debate the 1068 start another post that way I don't have to read what you have to say.

1/3/2007 7:12:45 PM

Somerset Ky

it is the best seed in the world until someone grows another bigger than 1502

1/3/2007 7:40:00 PM

Syracuse, NY

well-put, green goblin!

1/3/2007 7:46:23 PM

Eddyz@efirehose.net

In my humble opinion, I like my cross of the 935 Lloyd and the 898 Knauss. Only time will tell.
If I had to pick a seed to put on a pedistal, other than mine, it would be the 985 Werner, although the 1370 didn't make the marks I thought it would in 06, I believe the mix with the 898 Knauss should give it the extra little bit it needs to put it over the top, and probably the best thing this seed has going for it is where it will be planted. If this seed get's planted in Quinn's patch, and the weather is nice to him, Look out, because there will be a new kid on the block.

1/3/2007 8:03:47 PM

Eddyz@efirehose.net

OOPS hit the button too fast, The 1068 sibs should be right up there also.

1/3/2007 8:07:54 PM

Owensboro, Ky.

Hey you, I thought I typed LOL both before and after my statement...I thought that would let you know I was making a small attempt at humor. Such is life. Seriously, no offense meant. Peace, Wayne

1/3/2007 10:31:01 PM

Rhode Island

lets all have some wine and yep you guessed it c h e e s e

1/3/2007 11:23:54 PM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

What a timely thread. I've been thinking about this all week.

I won't get into the genetics debate since this isn't my field of expertise. But Tom (hey you) brings up a very good point when he says:

"The 723 is a very interesting seed to look at. It is a 1999 seed and grew a 1407, the #3 pumpkin in the world in 2005. Obviously, 1400+ genes have been present since 1999. That suggests to me that the weight increases we've seen can be more accurately attributed to improvements in growing techniques. Maybe that's why the 1502 came from the 1068. It was an excellent 1068 seed grown by the best grower(s) in the world who have a lot of experience with that particular seed."

The *potential* for the 1400-1500 lb weights were contained in the 723 & 1068 ever since day one. Tom intuitively notes that the 723 took 6 years to reach it's greatest known potential & the 1068 has taken 3 years to reach it's greatest known potential.

Since we know that the genetic code in a seed doesn't improve (or change at all) with time, then it stands to reason that some environmental factor is at stake.

Guess what?

The 1407 & the 1502 were both grown by experienced (and excellent) growers in brand new patches.

I know we like to think that genetics is the cause for all this growth. We'd also like to think that we can use a litany (or arsenal) of organic &/or chemical treatments to hold diseases at bay.

But guess what?

We can't.

Advice to all experienced growers: Move.
Advice to all new growers: Build a patch & don't grow in it for about 3 years. Grow in a remote location & kill average seeds until you have a clue. Then seek out the good seeds to grow in the clean patch you built 3 years ago.

At the risk of great & furious rath: Ronny had better give his 2006 patch a break next year or he may never see the high side of 1400 again regardless of the seed he chooses to grow there. Seriously.

1/3/2007 11:34:41 PM

SF Bay Area, California

Guess what - after six years of trying to break 1000 and never succeeding, I gave my patch a year's rest and did some solar fumigation.

The next year we grew four plant's and popped three over a thousand including my daughter's 1191. Even my 9 year old grew a 934. (and an estimated 700 on the same plant) Now, we all know that this wasn't just a haphazard occurence. Great advice Tremor...

1/4/2007 4:40:39 PM

Long Island,New York

Ok...thats cool. So as to save you all from a lot of wasted hard work and effort...and untimate defeat, Im growing on new soil this year so just pack it in now. Ill let you win next year.

1/4/2007 4:48:50 PM

Maine

I like the 1041 mckie 842 eaton x 1068 wallace. The 842 went 18% heavy and the pollinating 1068 plant went 20% heavy.Oh yeah and it was orange.

1/4/2007 6:40:06 PM

Rhode Island

Id have to agree with Steve (TREMOR)

Ronnie will never see the high side of 1,400 again.
Because Ron and I are shooting to break his record next year. Theres no question the seed is capable of it.

the trick is to get the 1068 to measure out at 1,450 and you got a great chance for 1,600.

The new patch is still virgin and on the improve. Expecting a few more years of happiness before we rotate to a new area.

Im sure other very good growers who post here will also tell you that once you have grown a special pumpkin and taken it from seed, to harvest, to blue ribbon, is not to concerned with grabbing the gold every year. (we are not either)

If it happens its great, but repeating is no big deal.
Its that first trip thats the very best feeling you could ever experience.

Pap

1/4/2007 9:38:27 PM

Lexington, Ky

Ah yes, that first trip. My first quarter mile (1320 feet) victory was the sweetest. Multiple repeats never held a candle to the first. Thinking 'bout painting my dragster Orange......

1/5/2007 12:13:42 AM

Syracuse, NY

no doubt, pap.
seeing that footage of your reaction to the announcement of 1450 was something to see and almost feel.
my highest regards to whomever videotaped that event;
yours AND Ron's! eric g

1/5/2007 2:05:34 AM