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N.e. Ct.

I have been looking at pedigree charts on the aggc. and I am amazed to see the amont of inbreeding that growers use.
At what point dose inbreeding become a problem, if ever???
looking to learn, any comments?

2/14/2011 11:25:02 AM

Menomonie, WI (mail@gr8pumpkin.net)

Not sure its considered inbreeding in the plant world. As most plant contain both a male and female flower. Some plants like a tomato self pollinate all the time.

2/14/2011 1:39:01 PM

Minnesota(dw447@fastmail.fm)

If you look at squash such as Blue Hubbard and Buttercup; these are highly inbred(I would think), and the same species as A.G.'s. They consistanly produce true-to-type fruits, as long as the pollinations are controlled. Before hybrid vegetable seeds, people passed down inbred seeds for many generations. Heirloom seeds are an example of these.

2/14/2011 6:15:00 PM

N.e. Ct.

Doug:I really can't talk about sqaush ,no experiance.
your example seems to indicate that inbreeding produces a more true-to-type condition between parent and child.
which could argue against inbreeding. especially if size has a genetic factor.

2/14/2011 7:07:40 PM

Alaska

Depends, some species are more tolerant than others. Are we talking perfect flowers vs separate male/female flowers and then there are self incompatibles.

2/14/2011 7:13:01 PM

Alaska

Another point I'd like to make is in order to get hybrid vigor you first need to have locked in certain traits whether it's color, shape, size or wall thickness. That's accomplished by crossing sibs from the same parent line that express those traits you are looking for. Doing it over and over again until you get lets say 95 percent of the seeds/progeny producing the desired traits you breed for. That in itself causes some inbreeding depression but you now have uniformity. Locked in certain traits and locked out certain traits.
Then if you take two highly inbreed lines and cross them together. Look out you now have an F1 Hybrid with noticeable vigor.
Traits can be so different that new varieties within the species are created.
Inbreeding I believe to a point is bad but to go through what I just described is a very long process.

2/15/2011 1:58:14 AM

N.e. Ct.

Spudley:
I think side with your point about inbreeding sib.'s to each other and parents to lock in a trait. The problem is you can't pick the traits so you get the BAD ones as well as the good ones.

2/15/2011 9:00:19 AM

Alaska

Firefly you say"The problem is you can't pick the traits". With all due respect you miss the whole concept of how hybrids are created. It starts with a simple selection process. If you constantly select only red pumpkins to cross and it's done from within one parent line using sibs over and over again eventually your seed will only produce red pumpkins. That's called a hybrid. Then if you take that hybrid and cross it with another different hybrid line the results are an F1 Hybrid. That's when you unlock the vigor.
The whole process has everything to do with choosing and picking those desirable traits. Hybrids are usually very uniform in what ever they were bred for, size shape color etc. Are hybrids rubber stamps of one an another, NO. There is always gonna be a few sports in the bunch/variation. But the overwhelming majority will be red pumpkins or what ever else the trait was you were looking for.

2/15/2011 1:23:20 PM