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Centennial Colorado

Hi all,
I am informing of a genetic project that I am doing next year. It appears to have never been done surprisingly. Recreating the 2009 Wallace. The cross will not be the same, but genetics will be more similar. Rather than 1725 Harp times 1409.5 Miller I will be doing 282 Scherber times 1409.5 Miller. The 282 Scherber is a clone from the plant that grew the 2009 Wallace, which would make it more similar than most Harp seeds. I think the Wallace genetics are great, but didn't have the opportunity to be grown by most growers due to the high initial cost of one. What do you think about this cross?

7/11/2020 6:48:56 PM

Corryton, TN

If you can get the 282 to go the first thing I would do is self it again just to preserve the genetic line! In my opinion the 282 was the best seed that virtually saw no dirt. EVERY squash over 1600 pounds is 50% 282 Scherber and 50% 615 Cantrell via Scott Holub's breeding.

I'd cross it onto the best modern selfed pumpkin seed you can get your hands on. Like a 2145 or 1911 selfed. As you know the hard part is getting others to believe in crosses that are not directly from 2000+ pounders. Get it done and send me a handful of each!

7/12/2020 7:22:15 AM

North Of The Border

Could work. I think it's not guaranteed to work, because each individual pollen grain that made the Miller is different, and therefore, the seed you jave, is different from the seed used to pollinate the 2009, but even so, it is a nice experiment, and could result in some really good seed stock. Hope you have good luck.

7/12/2020 7:24:16 AM

North Of The Border

Personnaly, I would just use whatever the best seed you have is, not necessarily the Miller, just to try and do, 2009 x good seed, instead of taking the clone the wrong way, and saying it is a parent of the 2009, I would act like it is the 2009, and use it like it has the same genetics as the 2009. Even though it is missing the Miller genes, I don't think it needs it.

7/12/2020 7:28:10 AM

Centennial Colorado

I like that thought. I think the Miller will still be started just in case it is the best. I think there is one selfed by Marc Sawtell, but I couldn't get any to start last year. Since I will only be growing for 1 more year, I think I could do the 282 X 511 Ritter. The Ritter is 1803 Gadberry X 1911 Urena. We know about the Urena being good, but the Gadberry is often overlooked with the cross being 2145 X 1405 Gadberry (1965 Brandt X 2230.5 Wallace). Either that or the Ritter cross this year of 511 Ritter X 1718 Ceja, which would also have 1317 Clementz genetics. What I mainly want to do is increase the genetic diversity of our seeds, so things like the Haist yellowing don't become more prevelant.

7/12/2020 10:15:24 AM

valtierra/spain

Why don't you do it with 1725 and 1409.5? That would be a remake, I don't know if there are many remakes ... but that would be fine.

10/15/2020 5:03:21 PM

Centennial Colorado

Finding a 1725 Harp would be difficult. Also have 2 people I know with same genetics if not better and several more seeds available. I might do it this year. Would be my team grow with a local grower. I want to be in 4000 lbs club and don't have space to give to a project like this. I think the Scherber would be better given it being from the exact same plant that grew the 2009.

10/15/2020 11:30:42 PM

Muddy Waters

Recreations are impossible. It would be liking taking 2 siblings say your brother & your wife's sister.Making a baby & expecting it to be just like your prize child. The odds are astronomical.Just saying to keep the odds real

12/19/2020 8:32:03 AM

Centennial Colorado

I guess we will find out. Maybe it will be better? Who knows? I will be using the 282 Scherber, which is 7/8 of the 2118 Jutras Squash. I have been told by Joe scherber that he has grown several and all closely resemble the 1725 Harp with both shape and color. Take the 1989.5 Daletas which is the same cross as the 2145 Mcmullen, many have had just as much success.

12/19/2020 10:52:35 AM

Syracuse, NY

We've all been here and dreamt of being able to create a super seed that will knock the socks off of the increasing weight curve of giant pumpkins - myself included; however, once one re-creates a seed, it is most-likely that that seed now will be exhibiting its own characteristics which may or may not be greater than or less than the original, and it will take YEARS on-end for the seed's producer to see the results and compare them to whatever the original seed produced and even then, who else will grow it until a new WR comes from it? Like I said, I've been here also, so, I can say with some certainty that anyone is better off growing the actual relic seed or one of thousands of others that may or may not have even been tried, and unless so, never will be, in the meantime - Good luck, but I suggest getting a 2003 Haist and giving that a try - you will lose your pumpkin MIND! That's shooting myself in the foot for upcoming auctions, but I do have thousands of others, including my own, to choose from, lol---eg

12/19/2020 12:43:12 PM

Centennial Colorado

I did successfully recreate the 2528 Geddes. The reverse cross was more orange, so I chose it. My 511 has grown 10 pumpkins over 200 lbs, but no one wanted to show up to the weighoffs and show off their huge fruits. Wish covid didn't exist. Many were older and afraid of getting exposed. I hope to get the aggressive sidevines that I typically have had with wallace decendants.

12/19/2020 4:17:06 PM

North Of The Border

The only way to do that would be to do what Matt DeBacco does, and take clones. Your brother, and your wife's sister won't be genetically identical to you, but your identical twin, and your wife's identical twin would be. Just saying...

12/19/2020 5:33:29 PM