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Halifax, Nova Scotia

I know that a 25 Beachy grew one over 800 pounds, so there is potential to grow a large pumpkin from the seeds of a small pumpkin, but how much potential does a seed from a pumpkin under 100 pounds have? The reason I'm asking is I have started gathering seeds from the friendly folks around BP.com, and they all have decent genetics behind them, but the pumpkins they came from range from about 50 pounds to over 700 pounds. Should I be looking at the seeds from larger pumpkins first, or would it be more beneficial to look at the genetics behind these pumpkins when I make my decision on what to grow? I'm sure this is one of those questions without a black and white (orange and green?) answer, but genetics is one of the aspects of AGs I haven't learned a lot about yet, it's something I plan on puruing through this site over the winter to help me make my decision come spring. Thanks all.

10/6/2004 12:12:41 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

Unlimited potential.
There are numerous examples out there...582 Hester, 310 Eisenhaur, 237 Beachy, 419 Pukos, 611.5 Hester, 600.5 Gregory, *723 Bobier*, *846 Calai*, 709.5 McCallum, 730 Stellpflug, 691 Castellucci, 708 Larue, 746 LaRue '01, 646 Pukos, 708.5 Holland, 545 Handy, 735 Pukos, 695 Handy, 805 Pukos,....and these are ones just off the top of my head, *lots* of other examples out there.
There are many, many sub-400# seed out there that could easily produce very large pumpkins, but they get passed over in favor of the 900-1000#+ seed that folks covet. If you research the issue, I think you'll find many of the 1000# pumpkins grown over the last 10 years, come from 800# pumpkin and less seed. If you like the genetics of a 300#'er, and the grower reports it was a good plant and pumpkin...grow it. I myself do several crosses each year just for the crosses, and the seed usually come from 300-400# fruit. My 307 from last year wasn't tested by any high-profile names this year, but it's producing fruit that are 15%-26% heavy over-the-chart.
Just because it's from a small pumpkin, don't shy from it. The more of these seed are getting grown with great results, the more this mistaken concept is losing merit.

10/6/2004 12:44:44 PM

Long Island,New York

There is a bit more "known ability" that comes from using a big wieght seed...you know its mother was successful. Its not a known with a smaller seed. Thats not to say a smaller seed is any less able to do what any other seed can do. You DO want to know the story...the full story....behind any seed you grow. This is where the "relationship" with the grower of the seed comes in ....the comradory if you would. Why was it small? Is there a reasonable reason why its small? Shock absorbers found on plants with big fruits have the same genetics....absolutely no reason to avoid them. Fruit done for the crosses--no reason why NOT to grow them...however, no known reason why TO grow them, unless a hunch counts or a similar successful cross is known, or the grower has other significant reasons...etc. The bottom line is you have to know why it was small. (BTW...my 218Andrews99* squash (738stellpflugx879rockwell) that Greg Kurkowski just grew to a S.Dakota State record 859lb Squash was a shock absorber fruit...thats why it was small.)

10/6/2004 5:58:57 PM

Cologne / Germany

G is completely right here. Imagine how many good crosses with mature seeds end up on the compost pile only because they were "secondary vine culls" that never had a chance to show their full potential.

10/6/2004 8:22:42 PM

San Diego, Ca.

My 281 I grew this year should be a very good seed. It's an 846 Calai selfed X 845 Bobier selfed. The pumpkin didn't get very big for me because the plant nearly drowned due to poor drainage. Hopefully someone will give it a try. I think it will grow some good sized pumpkins. The genetics are there. If anyone is interested in some, just e-mail me.

10/6/2004 11:26:54 PM

No Place Special

I am growing a pumpkin on what remains of my 869.5 Calai plant. It is currently at day 30 today and probably around 20 lbs. It is pollinated with 842 Eaton. I am growing this pumpkin JUST for seeds and it will get grown by me for sure next yr. Just an FYI, the 869.5 Calai plant produced an 1125 lber for me (went down to a mouse and was still growing at 19 lbs a day) and the 842 Eaton plant produced the new Iowa State record for me at 1083 lbs. I expect the seeds from my little less than 40 lb pumpkin to be world class. Mike Frantz

10/7/2004 10:28:34 AM

Napa Valley, CA

This same question was asked at an AG genetics seminar in the northwest a few years ago. The speaker, a genteics expert, told us that a 200 lb. pumpkin and a 1,000 lb. pumpkin of the same cross have the same "potential" of producing a world class fruit. I agree with this. I think that many seeds from 200 to 500 lb. pumpkins that have great potential will be rotting in growers seed boxes and never be proven.......the obvious reason.....we all think that bigger is better ! George Webster

10/8/2004 2:53:33 AM

Huntsburg,Ohio

Hey i grew a pumpkin off the 978.6 Berard and it was like 7 pounds but it was crossed with the 1370 rose and i tell you what i think it will do good and i will be planting at least one seed from it next year.Clinton Rose

10/10/2004 7:42:59 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

BTW...If anyone is looking for 1260 Weir genetics as a pollinator, I've got a seed for you.
I grew the 572 Andrews (1260 x sibb) this year in a 80 sq ft space. Grew a 175# on it and crossed with the 1260. I let the pumpkin mature (it reached it's full potential in such a small space), then pulled the plant.
Cleaned the seed out today...they are large, mature, and very full.
3 in 1 on the 1260 genetics = nice pollinator.

10/10/2004 7:57:34 PM

That State Up North

21 Beachy

10/10/2004 8:14:24 PM