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canal winchester ohio

I know the pattern now leans somewhat towards remakes of certain seeds 723,846,801.5,ect..But I'm wondering which ones have shown similar results. Now I don't mean the same grower, like Bill B. remaking his 723 or Fred his 846 because of the fact it's the same grower,same tendencies towards growing & same climate.
I'm wondering about remakes created by different growers of the original seed.
Thanks in advance for any & all imput............Paul

11/5/2004 9:02:53 PM

Ann Arbor, Mi

Hi Paul,
I find it hard to believe no one else has replyed.
I remade the 846 and 705. My 846 remake has grown me a new best past 2 years. Old best was 655. Grew 790 in '03 and 830 in '04. The 705 remake I grew a 547.5 won the state fair in '03 and is still my personal best at the state fair.
Also I grew an 801.6 on my own seed this year, good stuff can come from your own stock.

Bob

11/7/2004 5:24:26 PM

canal winchester ohio

Thanks for the info Bob, I really thought this would be a thread some folks could learn something from......I guess I was wrong.
By the way I agree on the thought about growing your own stock. The cross I would like to make next season involves a seed that was grown in my area & another seed grown just northeast of me. I'm thinking using ones from my area will be a plus, therefore giving me seeds for the following years that will take me where I want to be.
Am I making any sense................Paul

11/7/2004 6:28:33 PM

canal winchester ohio

I know everyone would like to have a seed from their own stock folks want to grow. Well here's your chance, I'm willing to bet that from the above info from Bob he will get some mail from interested growers.
So come on & toot your horn about your remakes....

11/7/2004 6:38:38 PM

Www.extremepumpkinstore.com

This is very interesting!

11/7/2004 8:11:49 PM

Choctaw, OK

I think this is an interesting thread as well. I havent made any remakes myself, but, on a faintly similar note, I have made a few one of a kind crosses, atleast to my knowledge. I feel they could do very well if tried. The 1097 Beachy is 845 bobier x 723 bobier. I have a small genetic seed that is 838 bobier x 714 bobier. Very similar stuff and this seed was tried and impressed the grower in a "test" area and he plans to try it for competition next year. The 714 male grew the 778 Uow Glisczinski that was around 10% heavy. I also have a genetic cross of 838 bobier x 846 Calai, which is similar to alot of the 723/845 x 846 crosses and vice versa.
Another interesting cross i made was the 502 Palbrach 2003. I started a 783 daletas back in 2003 and gave it to a friend to grow. He went on vacation in early july and i pollinated this fruit for him with my 846 plant. The fruit went down to mice and i went over to save the seeds from it and have kept them. The same plant grew the 619 Palbrach 03 (which is on the aggc site). So, all in all, the 502 cross is 783 Daletas x 846 calai. The 846 grew my 830 2003 which was a great orange color and about 13% heavy. The 502 grew my 730.5 2004 fruit (in our horrible cold summer weather this year) that was 13% heavy as well w/decent orange color. The 838 bobier x 846 cross mentioned above grew a 702 and 684 first year out, both of which were near or over 10% heavy.

11/8/2004 12:26:57 AM

Choctaw, OK

I guess it goes to show that many seeds have potential. Its just if they can get a chance by a heavy hitter or maybe a newer grower can hit big. Many of my seeds have a male pollinator that "did well" and i think thats a major part in making a good seed. Obviously, that doesnt work for all cases.
My whole goal with these crosses is to make orange and heavy. I have done well so far, but the results are too limited yet to give a conclusion and probably as with all seeds, no seed will be consistant enough to make everyone happy.
I would say, if you have a seed of your own you really like and think it will do well, give it a shot...you just might be surprised. Might be better than trying to spend time and an arm and a leg to get that coveted "hot" seed. -Case

11/8/2004 12:27:09 AM

Covington, WA

I grew a pumpkin last year that was the same cross as the 582 Hester. Unfortunately the fruit only produced two seeds which I thought might be viable. I grew one this year and produced a 497 lb. fruit from it. I selfed that fruit in order to get more seeds with that same genetic background. The plant that was a reverse of that cross did much better for me though. Both fruit had similar shape and color and looked as if they could have been grown from the same seed. Could these have the same potential as the 582? I suppose so, as there were a lot of 582's that split, flat vined and didn't produce so yeah, I guess it could. I'm not knocking the 582 some folks have had spectacular results with it. I've been able to grow some great plants from great pumpkins, but my best results have still been from my own seeds and my own unique crosses even though that wasn't the case this year.

11/8/2004 1:16:09 AM

Amherst, WI

The 527 Glisczinski (716 Miller x 865 Mettler) Was my attempt to duplicate the 845 Bobier. The 716 Miller was 935 Lloyd sibbed. I grew the 527 this year and got a 855 from it. I'm sure it would have gotten 1000+ in a normal summer, it was so cold here and it still did well.

11/8/2004 10:14:40 PM

Western NY

no remakes here, but i had hoped for something better. i wanted to refine the 846, so i crossed a 760 patrick (801 selfed) with a 476 beachy (876.5 selfed). the pumpkin was a beautiful 427 pound fruit. mixed results so far. mine and a local had splits, but AXC grew a beautiful 575 from it. i may try it in the field next year.

oh- for anyone interested, the same setup was done this year with the 898 line. 820 werner x 870 powers.

11/9/2004 11:01:55 AM

That State Up North

My 2-cents worth
I am not a big fan of re-makes. We want to be continualy improving, then why go back to doing the same thing over? What Andy is doing is moving in the positive direction. Take the crosses we know work, and clean them up geneticaly. The more pure each parent is in an F1 hybrid, the more consistent your resulting seed will be. I say, lets move on to bigger better goals then duplicating the past, lets excede all expectations in the future

Nic Welty

11/9/2004 3:14:28 PM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

Hey there's always the chance a remake could work better than the first time around too.

But in general I agree it is better to move forward than look back.

11/9/2004 3:31:25 PM

Abbotsford, B.C

I know that this doesn't have anything to do with remakes, but when Case said that no seed of yours will be consistent enough to make everyone happy (going for color, I suggest that you try growing the 310 Marining 04 (see post in seed exchange called Big, Round, Orange - Seeds Available) the cross is [(869.5 Calai x self) x self]. Beautiful, consistent, color & shape. Just thought I'd let you know, if you might be interested.

Cameron

11/9/2004 6:49:45 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

A seeds' gotta have at *least* 5-6 progeny before one can say it's "consistent"

11/10/2004 12:57:45 AM

Colorado Hail, CO. Elev. 5,900 FT

I'd have to side with Nic's point of view too, but as Steve pointed out, there is possibility to remake something better than the first. If your long term goal is to breed YOUR remake X the original, thats well worth the effort.

There are other ways to be creative also... I crossed Garrell's Lloyd genetic {1092 X self} with the 704 Stelpflug {865 Mettler}, which is a more purified Llyod X Mettler Bobier genetic line than anyone has ever created {Unless Nic or Tom beat me to it...LOL}. My early prediction is heavy & big fruits, primarily white in color, but consistent in offsprings results. Check back in 365 days, LOL!

Here are a few ideas everyone should consider doing:

1}Research the parental history of the seed genetic you like the most...
2}Try to throw a selfed fruit on your favorite genetic each year, even if you have to grow a plant in one of your drunken friends yard.
3}Work out a long term plan with another grower{s} who's using identical breeding techniques {but with very different ancestory than yours}. Eventually both of you will have one of a kind isolated genetics to combine together... perhaps the "next 898/845/723/846" gentic wonder cross.
4}Selective self breed as well. The best plants {selfed... but of course} are top on your list for the following season. Keep notes/ write down observations for "the years to come" research.
5}
Keep your goals and abitities attainable, don't over do it or risk neglecting your main plants} as a result. Set yourself up some long and short range genetic plans to work around. .

11/10/2004 7:11:05 AM

Indiana

Sorry Marc...beat you to it....LOL

Tom

11/10/2004 9:56:21 AM

Omaha, NE (N41-15-42 )

I'm a forward looking person myself, but we can be as philosophical as we want, but if I'm willing to bet that if a lot of us here had a 935 Lloyd and a 865 Mettler, the temptation would be too great to give it a try.

11/10/2004 11:12:52 AM

Long Island,New York

I'll bet you're right JMattW

11/10/2004 6:33:17 PM