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San Jose

What mix do you recommend for heirloom/garden tomatoes?
I have been using Black Gold Organic seed starting mix with
good results--is there something better or is that fine? I
start them (72 cells) in a plastic tray/dome lid with heat
mat at 80 degrees.

1/22/2024 3:38:01 PM

Walla Walla Wa.

If it works good that's great,I used to use black gold but one time it was a total disaster so never again. Now I've made my own for the past 30 yrs.

1/22/2024 8:13:45 PM

San Jose

Hi Dan, can you share your own mix recipe?

1/23/2024 10:49:01 PM

Walla Walla Wa.

When I get home from my 1-1/2 month vacation I'll try to make a video to add to my YouTube channel.

1/24/2024 9:08:05 AM

Grittyville, WA

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JZPjzIBquPM&pp=ygUoU2VjcmV0IHRlY2huaXF1ZSBncm93aW5nIHBsYW50IGZyb20gc2VlZA%3D%3D

"Secret Technique Starting seeds" Stefen Sobkow

Its fringe stuff, but plausible too... once upon a time one of my best plants came from one of my most horribly malnourished & neglected seedlings.

I've heard other people argue the opposite of this, that stress will shut down the genes for growth and one day of stress will cause weeks of lingering sub-optimal growth, but thats in mature plants, small seedlings can activate their genes faster, probably because the distance between the roots and the growth tips is so small.

I know you didnt need this alternate info kurt/gus, but someone else might find it interesting. The point being that there is this other vastly different approach to getting "a good start".

Just an alternative theory!

Dan is the best, and as far as we know, whatever he does is the best method.

1/24/2024 2:23:09 PM

Bethlehem CT

I watched the video I think the guy is right about starting seeds. You don't want overly rich and overly moist soil at first. In fact the best seed starting mixes are nearly nutritionless. (think of all the horror stories on here when people try a new mix like the one from miracle grow that is already loaded with fertilizer) An ideal mix is there just to provide the proper conditions for germination. The man in the video mentions that he keeps his deprived for 2 months, that semem like a long time to me. It may not hurt in the long run but I would argue at best it just puts the plants on "hold" Until better conditions arrive.
High moisture and high salts (from fertility). Are a recipe for "damping off" type disease and dead plants. The seedlings roots just can't handle much out of the gate. They have to crawl before they learn to walk and then to run.

1/25/2024 9:12:45 AM

Grittyville, WA

When he mentioned the affect on eucalyptus, my brain immediately switched it to tomatoes and pumpkins. For good formation of a large first truss mega, theyd probably need a favorable growth trigger by about the 3-4 leaf stage? If they built up a reserve of energy via sparse watering, cooler temps, or less nutrients, but could suddenly bolt all of that energy into the first flower bud...

It could be kinda like dandelions, how sometimes in early spring the conditions favor a bolt of nutrients and energy and growth that sometimes causes larger single and double "freak" flowers, during those initial favorable conditions of cool weather combined with a surge of sugars.

Getting the timing just right would be everything.

In fact, every time we water a plant it probably causes a mini surge of development, at just the right stage an extra surge could be what makes the cells in the meristem form out into a quintuple bud, instead of a triple or double or single.

Overthinking this & way up in the clouds now. Maybe its all nonsensical speculation.

Best of success to all.

1/25/2024 2:34:18 PM

Warwood

Is interesting to consider. Similar to the STUN method that several permaculture people recommended. Sepp Holzer (author and farmer) recommended this. (Shear Total Utter Neglect).
If you read on megablooms studies and some posts on this older board you'll see how tomato seedlings and into veg stage, beaten down by weather, temp, wind, animals, dry conditions etc. produce more and larger megablooms. Mostly cold stress earlier in season have also caused more megas on eating type tomatoes. However, most growers don't want megas. WE do!

1/25/2024 5:42:49 PM

Bethlehem CT

https://ag.umass.edu/vegetable/fact-sheets/tomato-cat-facing

1/28/2024 8:49:26 AM

Bethlehem CT

You guys might be onto something,it seems low temp and a few other factors bring on stress which induces what they call "catfaced tomoatoes" in commercial tomato lingo. (Which they see as a problem). Giant tomato growers identify the situation earlier and call the phenomenon a "Mega Blossom"

1/28/2024 8:54:49 AM

Fair Oaks CA

I literally put mine in the refrigerator nightly last year to see the affect. The verdict is still out since they didn't appear to perform any better/worse. Pictures are in my diary from 2023. I will try a few again this year to see if they enhance megas. For starting mixI use choir vermiculite perlit with a splash of worm castings. Been doing that for 20 years. I have never had an issue.

1/30/2024 9:51:33 PM

Grittyville, WA

Does the refrigerator dehydrate/dehumidify the air? If so then extra transpiration through the leaves will actually reduce the calcium levels in the plant, from what I understand. I'd suggest trying something along the lines of low temps but with higher humidity.

In fact, it seems like I cant hit 5 lbs UNLESS my plants are dripping with condensation in the cold a.m. hours. But, there I go again with my own personal theories.

1/30/2024 11:17:19 PM

Fair Oaks CA

I did not notice any dehydration. They were taken out each day and moved outside ar sunrise. Once the sun went down it was back the the refrigerator. Ah what we do for a tomato

1/31/2024 5:27:58 PM

Colorado

I've have every plant in the past two years put out first truss megas. Both years we had a bit of a cold snap after planting. Nothing as bad as frost but close like 38ish. Coincidence? Maybe but that is my experience so far.

1/31/2024 6:32:35 PM