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Trumbull, CT 06611, USA

I am having much difficulty staying on this site because of many growers bashing others for trading seeds. No one has ever made any remarks to me, but please stop making nasty comments to the growers who enjoy trading seeds as a hobby. You are really ruining this site with your negative comments. For example GAD's, if you have a problem with someone trading your seeds like Killer Rose - keep your seeds to yourself. Seed trading is a hobby. Nothing wrong with it. Next you people will complain about growing to many plants and that it is not fair that people have the land to grow them on. GROW UP!!! Please feel free to comment - Ray Leonzi

11/7/2003 8:38:07 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

If trading seeds is unethical, why is this section of the website even here?

The title of this board is "Seed Exchange".

Not a great place to use the old "shift 4", but it seems to be a fun thing for those who participate.

IMHO

Steve

11/7/2003 10:10:48 AM

Montoursville, PA

Well I 'aint collecting saving and trading. Any that I have will go into the pumpkin poker game, Port Elgin, next spring. If I come up a winner I shall donate the awsome excess to this site where you may capture them for the cost of ship and handle.

I will reserve for personal use one or two if BB happens to call me and lose one of his non-descript little known seeds. This assumes I can capture a chair in the game. :)

11/7/2003 10:57:55 AM

Webster, NY

I see nothing wrong with trading. I don't thing it is appropriate to sell without permission.

11/7/2003 11:01:11 AM

Liverpool , England

Hey....I gots lots of old seed to trade...early 90's....mid 90's..late 90's. E-mail me your wants list. I love to trade whatever anybody thinks.Only seed that I'm after is 895.5 Hester.

ALUN

11/7/2003 1:39:25 PM

Liverpool , England

Oh yeah...I'll swop for others not just a 895.5.

11/7/2003 1:40:56 PM

Montoursville, PA

Oh...just thought of this. If my seed ends up in the swap box or seed storage of any other description they are at least in circulation ready to be husseled by any means to the people who may want them. My age mandates that this is good. They are of no value in my freezer.

I'm relatively sure no large crowds will accumilate at the final auction, in this back yard, to buy old pumpkin seeds.
They would most likely be found in the dumpster with my other nondescript saved and highly valued worthless possessions like my endless supply of 100% cotton threads used to restore anchient dolly clothing.

We are only ordained to collect, save and trade "any stuff" for something short of seventy five years, in most cases....and that is a genetic fact. ;)

11/7/2003 2:00:50 PM

Aberdeen, SD

i have some seeds left from when i first started growing, as this was my first year growing. i got some extra seeds from people who were kind enough to give them to me to establish a good genetic base for me to start from. i am thankful for those whom sent me seed when i requested it. and this year, when i tried to grow, i lost probably a good dozen or so plants. i tried to get an initial 8 started, 4 survived. i got those 4 in the ground and those 4 died. so i started again. i started 6 seeds, four of those 6 grew and out of those 4, i got two pumpkins off of them. so this is a good thing.
now out of the seed that i had gotten, i made up some packets for friends and family to grow. and then i had talked to several people about growing and i provided seed to them as well. a couple of the people were even primary school teachers. so this is good i think.
i just hope that one day i will have enough seed to be as generous as those who have given to me.
and no i still havent heard anything about my seed from the two pumpkins i grew this year ... not cool

11/7/2003 4:19:35 PM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

I hear you Dwaine. I will glady trade seeds or chemicals for the genetics I really want. But I've given away literally hundreds of seeds in just the past year with many hundred due to be delivered to the children & faculty of my sons school.

That said I see no reason not to properly store & keep those seeds I think may hold promise with an eye toward the future. You, Jerry Rose, Bart, D. Garrell, & bothers have been very generous. I wish I had room to plant them all. But they'll stay in my freezer (I will NOT trade these)until I either see them performing or have space to do them justice. Two plants isn't very much space, but it's what we have.

Steve

11/7/2003 5:56:34 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

Here, here Ray...
There's too many hipocrits out there, noone in particular, who cry foul yet do it themselves.
According to some, if you have anything more than what you're gonna plant the next year, you're a hoarder...I guess most of us are "hoares"
Same argument as last year...there's way more seeds than growers so what else ya' gonna do with 'em?
Peace and love to all......

11/7/2003 6:48:16 PM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

Josh's post is gone. I'll trade his list & his email for an 845 or 846! LOL

11/7/2003 11:07:08 PM

Deer Park WA

I will happily give my seeds to those who commit to growing them; RayL I would be extremely happy keeping my seeds as well as my comments to myself if some of your fellow seed trading friends agree to quit sending me "Gimme Bags" asking for my seeds and then trading them off instead of giving them a shot in their patches. It's called ETHICS.

11/8/2003 1:14:42 AM

Kuna, Id.

Gads,
I'm new with the trading thing and last yr was the first real yr. I sent out bubble packs. I never sent you one as some of your post before had mentioned that you expect your seeds to be planted. As a new grower I was told to hold on to new seeds for a yr. to see how they do. If they do good plant them if not hold or try them if you like the cross. I gave out a lot of seeds to friends and other growers looking for the genetics in that cross. What did I ask for in return. Nothing. I plant 12 plants and will do even more this yr. out of the 12 6 were unproven seeds that I liked the crosses on. Once again as a new grower I have learned that having a seed from every pumpkin out there is not the way to go. But we have to learn some way. If I understand your post right you do not trade seeds at all, thats up to you. I don't know how many of your seeds got planted by others then you this yr. but from what I see sending seeds out is the best way to get them planted. So far this yr. I have told 2 people thay can have a seed from me. And I havent asked for a trade seed yet. If they don't have something I want I may just ask for a few seeds from the cross. By they way the seeds I'm giving away are a 865 Mettler and a 842 Eaton. I'm sure Mr. Eaton would rather have his seed in the ground rather then on a shelf. He sent it to me "Yes" but being plated by Joe Blow is better then sitting. Not ment to upset you just a new guys look at it.
Ken

11/8/2003 2:19:22 AM

Appalachian Mtns.

Yo Gads,
You're a good fellow and all but there's more important things then being so anal about seed and worrying who's asking for 'em? Who's gonna *trade* 'em? OhHHH the dirty word! Ohhh, you dastardly bastardly, how dare you ask and not plant!
Just keep your "mountains of seed", nobody wants 'em anyway with your ridiculous attitude.
BTW...nice squash you did this year, can I have some seed?!

11/8/2003 5:48:23 AM

Rocky-r@stny.rr.com

Southern,

If you get some of Gads squash seed, wanna make a trade?

11/8/2003 6:40:18 AM

Appalachian Mtns.

:0)

11/8/2003 7:20:31 AM

Trumbull, CT 06611, USA

Gad's, I for one do not want your seeds and never asked or will in the future ask for your seeds. Rumor has it that you have a pile of seeds. I wonder where you got them all from. I guess its is from all of the idiots and seed hoarders on this site. Most growers, I will say most likely a lot of growers on this site have seeds that they will not grow next year or any year., but then again I guess you only have 5 or so seeds for next year so I cannot inlcude you in that category. That is just the way it goes. Again, GROW UP

11/8/2003 9:44:42 AM

Ontario

I think your being a little hard on Gads. I think he feels a little betrayed by a grower or two. We don't know under what circumstances his seed was gained from him. If I recieved a mailing from someone that raved about my seed and said they'd love to try it and then a week later I see it on someone's trade list....Well Hell ya I'd be a lttle pissed! But!...Saying that... We have to be mature enough to understand what people are like. Everyone is looking for an edge. It's human nature. If you don't want to hand out seed, then don't. Only you can let yourself be a victim. I feel that your better served by having your seed circulated than just sitting in a jar in the basement. If your lucky somebody will plant it but odds are it won't. Most seed are never tried out at all but if you give enough out it at least has a chance. I've got a set amount of seed that I'm going to keep and the rest are going to be traded or given away to all that ask for seed. If those people want to trade them so be it. Those seed are no longer my property as soon as they're dropped in the mail box and there's at least a chance a person who really wants them will finally plant them.

11/8/2003 10:19:31 AM

Appalachian Mtns.

Being hard on Gads? Sorry, don't see it that way. Same ol' trader bashing and seed police all rolled into one and Gads has it hard?

Let's take an informal BP poll....

Respond with "Yay" if you feel trading is normal for giant pumpkin growers, fun, and perfectly ethical and moral....OR

Respond with "Nay" if you think it's subversive, wrong, unethical, and "sneaky"..even tho' 95% or better of growers do it.

Wonder which answer will lead the popular opinion poll?

11/8/2003 10:56:09 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

I have to agree I see the point that Cowpie brings up. Seed requests can place us in a moral dilema at times. For starters, I have never requested seeds from anyone I hadn't met or at least conversed with in privated via email at least several times. During these communications, I have always found out who I was dealing with & got a good idea what flavor our transaction were going to be. Easy for me. I'm in sales.

Perhaps when sending out Bubble packs, the requesting party could include a note asking how the grower would like the seeds handled. Be up front about it & indicate in advance if this seed is desired for growing, archival with an eye toward the future, or for open trade.

Likewise, folks who are being requested might want to indicate their wishes clearly.

I will wager that most folks would rather see their seeds grown & might be hurt if they send them thinking that will be their fate, only to later learn they've been traded away.
I myself went into winter last year with newly acquired seeds that I was planning to plant. But as I met & communicated with more growers, I found myself sitting on a pile of better genetics. Seeing the dilema building. I contacted the senders & indicated my wishes to "spread the wealth around". No one took offense. But then not one seed was traded either. I gave them to friends, relatives & customers who were expressing interest in "Steve's new hobby". But I do still archive at least 1 or 2 of everything new just in case it turns into the next "Hotty Seed". LOL

So perhaps it's not what we do, but rather how we do it that compromises the practice. Open dialogue & communication are the key to successful trades in anything.

Just my $.02 for whatever it's worth.

Steve

11/8/2003 10:57:39 AM

Appalachian Mtns.

Oh, and Gads...you can't bust my chops 'cause I sent all your seed back to you last winter.

11/8/2003 10:58:27 AM

Ontario

Hey, I've got no problem with seed brokers. (Notice I didn't say hoarders ;0) ) I feel they're a help to the hobby. If you need a particular seed then it's a good place to check. Hopefully after the dust is settled in the spring everyone gets the seeds they wanted and the brokers are helpful in this. If you re-read my other posting , I was just commenting on the fact that we don't know what was said in the giving out of Glads seeds. I really don't think he should get too upset about it. Somebody will get his pumpkin seeds that really want them eventually. Sorry if I touched a nerve southern. I've traded with you before and know that I ended up more than happy with the results. :0)

11/8/2003 11:21:09 AM

Key West, FL

The way I see it, I see it from the point of the person who is trading for the seed. Thats just part of getting my seeds out, why not if the person who has the seed doesn't want to grow, it trade it to a person that does want to grow it.

11/8/2003 12:36:52 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

I apologize for ranting, I'm just sick and tired of the same old topic every year, with the same old rambling that denies and defies the actuality of the true situation...pumpkin growers obtain and trade seed, period. It's NORMAL.
So do tomato, watermelon, flower, zucchini, fart plant, etc. growers the world over. It's NORMAL and internationally accepted...get over it!

11/8/2003 12:58:59 PM

Covington, WA

Hey southern, could you send me some fart plant seeds? I'll swap some squash seeds for them. At least if I'm growing fart plants I won't take all the blame all the time.

11/8/2003 1:30:45 PM

Itzetown City

Me too, but only if they give a sound like a moped.

11/8/2003 2:34:23 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

too funny, ya made me laugh :0)

11/8/2003 2:53:34 PM

Calif

all the pumpkin growers I have met are the most greatest of people.--- biased I know..perhaps its the common bond of experiences or the love of something wild and fun.

all we can do on this forum is express our thought which are opinions----nothing more. Not really police or the rule but a feeling. Is anyone wrong ? probably not........ But the dream of sending seed to sincere grower that will give it a try --is not to be slighted.
MB

11/8/2003 7:18:51 PM

Appalachian Mtns.

well said Mike, food for thought

11/8/2003 7:29:48 PM

Glad's , I agree with you, if someone wants your seed to grow that's great, If someone want's your seed to trade, that's the shits, you can do that as well as they can, so why have a in between guy. In the last 5 or 6 years, I have sent out approx 300 seed per year to meet requests, very few of these have been grown ,to me the grower that is really a slap in the face, your seed is good enough to reguest but not good enought to try. LOL So I like you this year will not give it unless you are willing to try it. So keep your bubble packs for the ones you intend to grow.

11/8/2003 7:31:27 PM

Rocky-r@stny.rr.com

I still have plenty of 771 and 679 seeds from 2000 if anyone wants them to grow or trade. I don't care what you do with them, as long as they possibly get into the hands of a grower who may plant them. Even if they don't plant them, some day, they may give them out to a group who is doing a fun contest or whatever... Do as you please..

Anyone wanting a Checkon 815 x Lloyd 935 cross, I will send 2 of each to everyone who sends me SASBP. I want to get them out as they are now 3 years old, and do me no good sitting here.

Figure this people, if I sat on these seeds forever, they go totally to waste. If I send them out, and someone grows them, great.. If the new "owner" of my 771 or 679 decides to trade them away, even better for him, as it may have helped him get a seed he can use. Once it leaves my hand, it isnt mine anymore. Have fun with it..

Here is my addy..

Rocky Rockwell
112 Roosevelt St
Sayre, PA 18840

If you want me to wait till the 717 squash seeds dry, let me know.. I will do that...

I love winter bickering... If we didnt get it, I would have figured I was at the wrong website!

11/8/2003 8:55:54 PM

Greencastle, PA

It wouldn't be offensive to me if someone wanted to trade one of my seeds. I'd be happy if people wanted them.
tom

11/8/2003 10:42:58 PM

Long Island,New York

Yes...I definitely think your all being too hard on Gads. You need to respect the grower's requests and, well, there's no place for the nasty comments here on BP (or anywhere else). You should also realize that the silent majority is just that...silent...and the nasty opinions expressed here In my experience are a vocal minority....most growers have more productive ventures than trashing people on a public forum.
That said, here's a point I havent seen yet...at the other end of a trade is the guy who gets the seed....the guy who is out there looking for the seed, perhaps to grow.In any case its nice to know your helping out another grower by seeing he gets a seed he wants and increasing the odds the seed your friend gave you gets grown.
I've had growers beg and plead for a seed I have only to trade them off within a week...Ive given away some really prime seeds that were given to me because they wanted to grow it only to have them trade them for gain shortly thereafter and it leaves a bad taste.I understand the origins of this thread.
To research genetics and pinpoint seeds you think will do well and try and obtain them is a smart way to go about this hobby...to indescriminantly mail gimmies can be abusive.To promise to grow then trade is wrong if the seed was given based upon that understanding.
In the end, people will do what people do and you soon know who is who........G

11/9/2003 8:54:04 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

There are valid points for all sides. My best genetics come from folks who are trading with me, not for seed, but for intellectual data such as chemical programs that solve problems & the tools required to see them through. In 75% of the cases, the seeds I have obtained aren't from hitters themselves. They don't need my help. The seeds have come from "seed traders" who either have relationships with hitters or who take the time to actively send out bubbles. Which I do not. So in my opinion, the traders make it possible for newbies to get better gentics.

I guess it's just me. But I feel weird send out mailings to folks I don't know asking them for free stuff. Maybe next year cash will have sterilized the seed begging process to the point where I won't feel strange mailing a SASE-Bubble to a complete stranger. For now though, the "traders" are doing me a terrific favor. Long live the traders.

Thanks be to proper networking.

Speaking of which, G, you ready for some deals?

Steve

11/9/2003 10:08:02 AM

Commack, NY

Ive sent out more then my fair share of seeds, and only a few of them have ever been planted. Most by close friends ive developed throughout the years on this site and the mallorn list. Most will sit in drawer's somewhere, and ya know what? so what. I dont really care. I had someone beg me last year for one of my seeds, saying that they were going to grow it, only to find out they didnt. Did i feel slighted? not really, it did bother me a little but i got over it. The one thing that really gets me is when you send a seed that wasnt from a pumpkin of yours. A seed you got from a grower, and someone wants it real bad. Maybe you consider this someone to be a friend, and give them that seed, then they turn around and trade it, or give it away. It happened to me last year, and i certainly would have preferred to grow it again as opposed to having it given away. The way the story was told to me was that the grower couldnt, or wasnt, going to grow this year, then gave the seed away. Then they ended up growing. I considered this person a friend, and would have appreciated the respect of being offered the seed back to me, considering it was basically given away for a song, but that was not the case. Hence, this person will no longer be receiving ANY seeds from me in the future, whether they are from my pumpkins or not. We've all cultivated relationships here, some good, some bad. Some of use get along better with certain folks better than others. In the end though, we're all just trying to grow the biggest darn pumpkins we can, by whatever means it takes. Im all for seed trading, but dont make a promise you can't keep. We all change our minds a million times when May rolls around, its difficult to keep promises you made in November. Politely ask for seed, offer some of your own, if you like it grow it.
think big!!
Scott

11/9/2003 5:44:24 PM

Long Island,New York

Well said Scott

11/9/2003 8:03:32 PM

Calif

I think the freedom to express a thought publicly is neat. Our veiws and thoughts are as different as the AG seed expressing themselves. I find most the time that how someone interpets your thought is far from what you were thinking. Thoughts and individual interpetations get added as the steamer gets rolling.
I think some of the original thought gets lost. I think one difference is that we all operate different with our word. Some take it as face value straight up ------I appreciate that.-I think there are some great post on be careful what you promise-probably not just here butin general-as the seed evolves so does the growers.---------hell i don't really pass judgement on no one!!! 10 years back I offered seed from my pumpkins for 5bucks for 10 seed.....unaware that was a no-no--stopped. Haven't traded much seed except once with Garrell but don't think its a bad thing --but feel its better to trade with a small circle and not the internet. I have some great swap friends each year ---But the time and conditions are different for each grower---some with time love all the requests .------!! but can't help the feeling that over collecting is causing excess work for all other parties....postal, grower , materials,,,,,I call it false demand. Because most just get stored never planted---but why not skip all that and keep the grower the bank?? I think a grower that helps prove a seed should have some reward of being able to access more seed. And the view from here is wait and see would serve all parties well.---just a thought--from one guy.
PS Had this thought too so what if you pissed everyone off and only had to fill a few seed request to those who intented to plant your seed --not that they HAD TOO! but realized you prefer those request....MB

11/9/2003 8:57:01 PM

Indiana

Say a grower gets 500 seeds out of a pumpkin and only has one pumpkin every year. Only can grow 1 plant the next year all things constant and all. If everyone did this. The ratio of seeds that get planted would stay the same. That means that on average 499 of them seeds will never get planted. Not good odds for the seeds....How many BTU's does a seed make?....... Not picking or making fun of anyyone...but when you think of how many seeds go to waste, it kinda makes me sick personally. I have about 30 lbs of seeds left from last year with what I consider good crosses on most. Dont have time to give them away anyway. Thank God my parents arent charging rent. Got seeds from this year in the shop, basement, barn, living room........got 4 dehumidifiers and a heater in the shop keeping it 72º and 21% humidity. Got the electric bill, and all that jazz. When I think about numbers like this....Why do I waste my time. Honestly if statistically only can plant 1 seed from each fruit. It dont make sense.

Tom Beachy

11/10/2003 12:18:59 AM

Ctpumpkin@optonline.net

Tom,

You've been at this longer than me. You've gotta hate mailing seeds by now. I stuffed 300 envelopes last night & they're still not ready to send. 200 more to go. This could get old fast. Printer ink, envelopes (cheap), $60 stamp, Bubble......And it's not the money. It's the time I didn't spend reading to my son last night. Why hot send them to John & Ken. Drew has a similar dilemma too. His new site wants seeds.

I'm paying the whole nut to anyone who has helped us or sent seed. I don't expect a PPBubble. And I don't mind in the slightest. It's the least I can do. These are the folks who got me started. But to send seeds will nilly all over God's green earth will take some of the fun out of it. And I really don't want to see any go to waste. Eighteen months ago I would have glady paid $10 for a half dozen of my worst seeds. Just never could find any to buy. I was looking for online seeds when I found this website. John & Ken sent them to me for the price of a stamp!

As the rest of the seeds finish drying, it's nearly time to return the favor.

Steve

11/10/2003 7:36:25 AM

Calif

Tom I hear ya, all these untried seeds-
As a farmer you constantly are looking for ways to improve efficiency--make less wasted moves to achieve your goal. I try and apply that thinking to our pattern of seed collecting. I don't think theres any right or wrong way . Personally I think the pattern of
collect-then wait and see adds work. Wait and see then collect is more direct. See the theory behind a growers intentions is get this seed out and in circulation increases the chance it might get planted.
And that certainly can work but alot of chance involved. You can send out 300 seeds and often draw a blank. Draw that blank and that seed is most the time history. there is only one way now to gaurantee it gets planted grow it yourself. I don't know but it seems if the pattern of seed request were more based on a commitment would more seed get tried? Would this serve growers better fewer more direct requests? I think with all the personal swaps and sending seed to groups seed gets circulated---hell i don't know just some thoughts it stopped raining c-ya...MB

11/10/2003 1:52:11 PM

Syracuse, NY

845s---bought from PandP--planted, enjoyed.
1140s---bought from OVGPGA-planted, enjoyed.
801 Black--asked for, planted, enjoyed.
1230 Daletas--asked for, planted, enjoyed.
960 Rose--asked for, planted, coulda enjoyed.
1109 Skinner--asked for, planted, enjoyed.
767 Catapano--asked for, planted, enjoyed.
and so on....
i guess this is MY growth curve. lol.
i am supremely in favor of someone getting a seed that they ask for because they feel they can grow it to the best of their ability at the time of their asking for it.
however, a lot can happen over the course of a winter.
plans change. a newer, hotter seed is discovered.
perhaps the old hot seeds have paled by comparison to the new ones. but if a grower promises he will grow a seed and
then trades it out not long after, i can see how the seed-sender can get upset about it. he will just never send anything 'good' to the trader-outer again.
live and learn. mostly live. once bitten, twice shy.
at least i didn't PROMISE anyone i would grow something of theirs and then not do it. if i had that inclination,
i would hafta bump another seed that i had lined-up but had not promised to plant. promise is a general term, here.

similar to some replies/comments above, i would LIKE to have my seeds used for a trade on the other end, because they are MY seeds, not ones i had myself coveted at one time!

at least i would know that i have helped that grower achieve his or her goal, indirectly, and that maybe the person that got the seed(s) would plant MY seed(S) soon...
(asked for, planted, enjoyed......) 'pal

11/10/2003 7:12:45 PM

Indiana

Tom I have plenty of room for all of your seeds. lol
Steve

11/11/2003 12:51:39 PM

Deer Park WA

RayL,

I got all my seeds from either clubs, wich are fare game for trading, or from growers who I traded my pumpkin genetics for theirs, (no promise's to grow), and the very few that I asked for and have either grown, or put high on the list to grow, ( no trading allowed ). Some of the seeds I have from clubs seed give aways are the 582((2 left), 1230 Daletas (((3 left), Daletas, Mombert, Emmons, LaRue, Handy, on and on. Yes I will keep the hot ones and try to incorperate them into my 9 plant scheme, but I will only "give" them to a charity or club. Again no hard feelings here, I do hope to "grow up" to a world record! LOL

Gerry

11/16/2003 10:50:53 PM

Usa

I don't see a problem with trading seeds. What grows in one area might not grow in another area as well. Heat and cold can both take it's toll on a plant. Some seeds seem to take one or the other better. Or someone might just have a spare seed that they tried already and decide it didn't produce the way they wanted it to and want to try a different seed. Or you could just want to try a certain seed. There shouldn't be any problem's with people trading seeds as it might be better for the seeds traded. There might be a better chance of them hitting dirt.

11/17/2003 4:17:10 AM

Potusmaker@yahoo.com

Thomas Jefferson traded seed... all sorts.

11/19/2003 12:26:01 PM

Nowhere

i get where RayL is coming from

totally.......

2/21/2010 9:11:40 AM