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Bristol, ME (stunner906@roadrunner.com)

Looking for thoughts.. With the unacceptable payout for top 3 by the current sanctioning body, the complete lack of promotion by the current sanctioning body, and the treatment as an inferior accomplishment by the current sanctioning body, is it time to break out and create a new sanctioning body for squash, by squash growers?

10/17/2013 5:59:18 PM

Lexington, Ky

Sure...are you willing to run with it?

10/18/2013 10:46:52 AM

Colorado

curious- What is the current payout for the top 3 by GPC? Also, is there a cash prize that comes with the green jacket?

Also, has anyone approached the GPC to see if they are willing to take the biggest squash to NYC and/or the top grower as well? Sure would have been nice to see Edwin and that beautiful squash on TV. Or at least the fruit. Perhaps a productive discussion would be beneficial here, if it hasn't been done in the past. Unless its a cost issue to get the fruit there, it doesn't make sense, at least in my opinion, why watermelon and long gourd are there, but not squash (even though there wasn't a WR squash this year).

Anyway, I know squash was GPC veggie a few years back, and still the top weights were "only" 1200-1486 pounds in the past few years. In my opinion, its a numbers problem- there just aren't enough growers growing squash to find those few lucky seeds that are exceptional, and therefore weights don't go up much from year to year, and the genetics don't get so much better every year like they do with pumpkins. there have been, on average, about 10 or so squash above 1000 pounds for the past many many years... until more people grow squash, It's not going to change much.

10/18/2013 9:31:07 PM

Colorado

that being said, I'm all for a new sanctioning body if it makes sense. I know Mark and worldwidegiantgrowers put on a REALLY nice squash competition this year with a good deal of prize money- i think well over $1000 total if I remember correctly. A few of us in colorado have been trying to build up squash as well, and plan to boost prize money around it at one of our weigh-offs. And I know you guys in Maine have really done well the last few years growing some really nice fruit, and also getting 5-6 to a single weigh-off, which is just awesome. And, although, a little off topic, I really think getting pumpkin genetics into the squash will someday be successful. I think some people think this strategy is "unsuccessful" but in reality, it just appears that way, as it takes a few years to build the color back in and just not enough people are doing it and growing the seeds to finally pop a big one. As soon as one of us pops an 1800-2000 pound greenie, I think the respect will follow.

Until then, I think its up to us to grow some big ones, and raise some prize money to put behind the effort. Locally, that is where a few of us are. If you need help with a new organization, I'll do everything I can to help. Seems like this discussion comes up every winter. Perhaps this year, we can get something formally worked out to promote the big green ones.

10/18/2013 9:31:13 PM

Colorado

also curious- what is the current squash payout for daramiscotta? is it still 1000, 500, 250? that's really impressive.

10/18/2013 9:44:05 PM

Saegertown Pa.

This is not a GPC problem it’s a lack of participation, if you look at the numbers in 2009 there were 141 squash entry’s in the gpc not counting EXH and DMG in 2013 there were 133 and all the years in-between the numbers are the same. If you look at the tomato it goes from 102 entry’s in 2009 to 228 this year, field pumpkins go from 84 to 250, watermelon 134 to 245. The pay put on squash for the GPC is 500, 300, 100 for the tomato watermelon and field pumpkins its 300, 200, 100 even though they have better numbers and are growing each year. The first year for vegetable of the year was squash, to be in the master Gardner you have to have a squash, I’m not sure what more the GPC can do. I know at are weigh off we used to get four or five squash, now we get one, are prize for squash has went from 500 dollars to 100 dollars because of lack of participation. If anything the GPC should do less for squash and more for field pumpkins, watermelon and tomato’s do to how much their growing and the squash aren’t. I think a squash organization is a good Idea, somehow there has to be some excitement for growing a squash, but I think you guys have a uphill battle because of a lack of participation.

10/19/2013 6:30:43 AM

St.thomas

Have to agree with Quinn. Squash seem to have a 'popularity problem' amoungst growers. Does that stem from the lack of appeal due to color or because growers are not findig success in getting a large green fruit to scale? I believe it to be the latter.

My thoughts are A massive green orb packing on the pounds 15 feet away from a orange monster is a thing of beauty and will garner an equal amount of excitement in your patch long before a weigh-off. The problem arives when you dedicate 800 sq.ft of garden space to a plant that doesn't produce!

Personally I have a tough time these days to post on BP due to family obligations and other commitmets of life which i'm sure we all have...but...this board is a great place to discuss our findings and what might help more of us get those massive emerald giants to the scales.

Instead of 'sanctioning' or pushing for increased recognition, lets get those green giants speaking for themselves, they'll command the attention instead of the grower demanding it.

Unfortunately this 1135 Jutras had a fatal stem crack that I couldn't solve, but make no mistake, this fruit reaped huge visual dividends for most of the 2013 season...even if it didn't pay off at the scales.

http://www.bigpumpkins.com/Diary/DiaryViewOne.asp?eid=208629

All the best with your green monsters next year :)

10/19/2013 9:11:18 AM

Corryton, TN

The sanctioning body is not the problem. With improved numbers they will change what needs to be changed.

With a quick look at the result pages of the GPC anyone can quickly determine where most of the squash get weighed, with only a few exceptions. The squash show up where the money is. Look at the number of squash that show up to compete against pumpkins when there is only one category. Then look at the numbers when squash are given there own prize structure. Take it a step farther and look at the prize structure of locations where a larger percentage than normal of the AG's that show up are squash (i.e. Damariscotta and several in Canada). Better payouts compared to pumpkins.

The answer to getting more and bigger squash is to separate and improve the prize structure at the club level, not decrease it because not many show up. I know this would put a strain on some sites and it won't work for them all especially if they're operating on a tight budget. But for those clubs that have a little more cushion don't increase the pumpkin payouts this year. Start a squash division with payouts that have the numbers to make it enticing to grow squash. Do it before planting season and advertise it to the world so that your growers will be inclined to put in a greenie or two and take a chance at winning the squash division.

Have you ever noticed how much attention a good squash gets? There not unpopular just underappreciated.

10/19/2013 4:39:05 PM

Bristol, ME (stunner906@roadrunner.com)

Very well, thank you for the input. Guess it is what it is..
I was just very disappointed that the 1264 Pierpont got almost no recognition. I felt bad and still do feel bad for Edwin because it's a heck of an accomplishment, and a US Record I believe. Anyway, thanks all for the thoughts, I'll go back into the woodwork...

Pete, Damariscotta pays 1000, 500, 200, 150, 100, 85, 70, 55, 40, 25 for Squash.

10/19/2013 6:17:10 PM

Colorado

wow, over $2K for squash. that rocks! too bad I live so far away from Maine...

10/19/2013 10:40:47 PM

Glosta

Increasing a prize structure is a good way to drum up interest but it doesnt solve the still unclear color rule. Trying to convince a grower to dedicate patch space to a fruit that may be dq for a white patch is tough, not to mention a grower showing uo with a beautiful greenie only to lose to a clearly non qualifying squash. I seen 2 this year that won and were way on the questionable side of color.

I too would like to see more squash recognition as well as other vegetables and posed this question to the GPC last year. and it comes down to interest. I guess in the end if we can prove there is an interest then we can find backing.

The Green Jacket does a wonderful thing, recognizing the largest true green squash. But it seems, and its clear in this post, that money is the only thing that draws people in. How did pkns grow to to the interest they are today? hopefully some longtime gowers and chime in and give us a little history, that way we can learn from past mistakes ans sucesses.

10/21/2013 1:25:07 AM

Kaukauna, Wisconsin

Most growers in are area will not grow squash because of the color problems. I attend four weigh offs this year and there was a color issue at every one of them.
A leaf on a tree is green all summer long. When fall comes they all turn yellow, orange and red. If this happens to your squash, you have a pumpkin.

10/21/2013 10:36:03 PM

Claysburg , PA

The color rule for squash needs to be addressed by the GPC this off season . There are alot of squash showing up at weigh offs that are very questionable even a GPC rep said that .

10/22/2013 1:11:39 PM

Leerdam, The Netherlands

I must agree with pete, Mark has done well with promoting squash with his worldwidegiantgrowers. I wish I had joined even though I had nothing this year to bring to the weigh-off.

I also back up Joel, Let get those Squashes speak for themselves!!

In the Netherlands we will have a squash battle amongst about every grower growing one, hoping already for a great turn out in 2014

10/23/2013 2:51:28 AM

St.thomas

(Maybe we should start a new post, but...here's what squash have said to me over the years...all just theory from observation ;)

1-"we seem to grow better on lower Nitrogen soil.

2-"we're born with a tan, and can warm to access in direct sun (may lead to aborts due to overheating)

3-"the sun later in life is our friend, and will allow us to achieve our full color potential (doesn't gaurentee 100% green though)"

3-"Look at our green 'Granny smith' cousin (as well as many other fruit with or without color mutations)..the pollination rate seems to be much better with a seperate pollinating plant or tree (982 sherwood seems to be a good one;)"

4-"If you want us for our money, you can take home a cheque by plumping us to 600 lbs!" (can't do that now with a pumpkin)!

5-"If you want us for our beauty, size and variation in your patch...we'll become great friends for many years:)

10/23/2013 7:48:42 AM

Cornelius, Oregon

After learning the hard way, be really careful in dealing with starting a giant squash club.

10/24/2013 10:25:33 AM

Colorado

what happened last winter Brett? I know you (and others) put a ton of time into it and it appeared to me that things were going forward smoothly.

10/24/2013 11:31:09 AM

Marion,IN

Ask anyone who was present for the squash meetings in the chat room what happened. From what I hear, I don't blame Brett for not moving forward. There were people who were constantly being disagreeable with whatever Brett was trying to discuss.

10/24/2013 12:20:06 PM

Willamette Valley, Oregon

Re: Prize structure

I was happy with the payout at Bauman's this year. $500 for 1175 lbs of green Cucurbita maxima. Non-green 1175 lber would have been 7th place and $300.

I'm concerned/hopeful that one day a greenie will be the largest C. maxima at the weigh off and come home with a smaller prize because it's green. That situation would not seem right to me. (Maybe that's happened already, I don't know.)

At a minimum it seems that we should keep that from happening somehow. Maybe we just put squash and AG on the same prize scale? That would prevent a 10lb squash taking home the full squash prize as the only greenie and ensure the biggest C. maxima takes home the most money. A single grower could enter AG and Squash and get prizes for both, as an incentive to bring a big squash. - just a thought.

10/24/2013 4:38:29 PM

St.thomas

Yeah it's happened 'bat' at one of the oldest fairs is our area 2 years ago.

-1st place pumpkin-1427lbs wins $2000.00
-1st place squash-1486lbs wins $300.00
(promotors up'd the squash payout the following year without hesitation)

Moral of the story...grow both:)

10/24/2013 5:02:30 PM

Cornelius, Oregon

There were just some very negative reactions and emails from people, so I decided to bow out. I never intended to ruffle feathers and step on toes but unfortunately not everything goes as planned. I appreciate the support I received from many people, but in the end, I want to trade stories, seeds and secrets with everyone and keep it fun.

10/24/2013 7:43:43 PM

Colorado

amen to that brett! thanks for the work you put in last winter.

10/24/2013 9:58:06 PM

Netherlands

We have separate trophies for pumpkins and squashes in the Netherlands, but the prize money does not distinguish between colour and over the years, greenies have beat the pumpkins and often finished in the top 3.

10/25/2013 4:07:00 AM

Willamette Valley, Oregon

Brad - Seems like that system could be implimented more widely.
Can a grower get a prize for squash and pumpkin in that scenario?

That would give more incentive to go "bigger" and green and not just green. Direct competition with the non-greenies. That certainly raises the bar.

10/25/2013 1:33:30 PM